Farming, Rural Life & Mental Resilience

This episode may contain content that could alarm or trigger some people. Listener discretion is advised. 

One of the things with mental health is no one wants to ask those questions because we all fear that we've got to have advice and we've got to have answers but sometimes people just need you to sit there and listen. Just there and listen and let it get off their chest. 

Hello I'm Guy Rowlison and thanks for joining me wherever you are to brainstorm. My guest today regards himself pretty much as just the average bloke down the road, but his journey and the work he's doing in the mental health and wellness space is anything but ordinary. Resilience, persistence and determination are just a few of the words that have been used to describe this husband, father of five, son, brother, grandfather and mate, who has not only dealt with his own challenges, but is helping hundreds of others find their feet as well. 

As a speaker, presenter and mentor, his keynote topics offer more than simply hope, but important strategies relevant to all ages, communities and professions from farming through to CEOs of large corporations when it comes to mental health and wellness. Known across Australia as the unbreakable farmer, Warren Davies, welcome. 

Good morning, Guy. Thanks for having me on. 

It's fantastic to be with you and have a chat this morning. Your story. is one of self-belief and relationships. You're presented to hundreds, if not thousands, from all walks of life about the need for resilience, tenacity, purpose in life, but that comes from a place of lived experience and having skin in the game when it comes to life lessons. What's the Warren Davies story? What was it like growing up? Your personal journey, the challenges, and how the mantle of the unbreakable farmer eventually came to fruition?

 I reckon I'll start there, Guy. I'll start with how the Unbreakable Farm was born. And it was really born out of me searching for my purpose and identity in life. I'd lost my way. I'd lost my farm and along with that, I'd lost my identity. 

And so I was on this search to even know, like as you've described, I'm a husband and a dad and a brother and a son and all that sort of stuff. My whole identity was tied up with my farm. So... It sent me on this journey of trying to, I suppose, find out who I, who I was. And, and yeah, what was the rest of my life going to look like? 

And I ended up doing a speaker course and, um, that kind of changed my direction in life, cause I didn't ever anticipate that I would be a speaker or a, you know, someone. who's in a privileged position like I am to travel around the country and share my stories in communities. 

But I basically did that course as part of, a bit of self-development, I suppose, to gain a bit of confidence, never imagining this where it'd end up. And my story, well, the unbreakable farmer was born at that course and it was, I suppose... My story is more about being broken than unbreakable. But there was a couple of lessons in that course. 

And the first one we had to share our story and I didn't really know what my story was.

And it definitely wasn't anything in regards to mental health because I never had the courage to actually talk about it to anyone really before I become a speaker. And we had to share our story and get up and those three words, that resilience, persistence and determination were three words that I kind of thought up in my head as I traveled down to Melbourne to this course. And that was what my, I suppose my, my pitch was going to be. It was going to be about, you know, resilience, persistence and determination and my farming journey more than my mental health journey. 

And getting up and sharing that story that day, I suppose probably changed my life forever, I suppose, that five minute talk. 

And I shared that farming journey. I really don't know what I shared that day, but it kind of resonated with the 20 odd that were doing the course. 

And the second part of that session that morning was to come up with a superhero name. which was as a dairy farmer and a bloke from the country was all starting to stand a fair bit far fetched for me. 

Like, you know, I set it sounded like a bit of, you know, a bit tostery. So I suppose that, you know, who needs a superhero name? Like it's just, you know, this is why it's on my comfort zone now. And, and that's, and, um, but luckily for me, after sharing that story, one of the guys come up to me, he's become a really good mate now. And he goes, I already know what your superhero name is. 

And I said, what's that mate, and he goes, you're the unbreakable farmer. And I thought that sounds pretty catchy. So instead of going to grab a coffee at morning tea time, I went to my computer and got on GoDaddy and searched the domain name, the unbreakable farmer, and it was free. So I registered it. And that's how really I become the unbreakable farmer. 

My story is more about being broken. you know, and having some challenges. And those challenges actually started as a kid growing up.

 Something else I learned from the speaker course, I probably knew deep down in my heart, but, you know, in my soul, but really hadn't, didn't have the knowledge or the experience or the education to actually acknowledge what had been going on as a kid. 

And a lot of that had been, it stemmed from being bullied at school. and it had a massive impact on my wellbeing. I had a massive impact on my mental health and a massive impact on my education. 

So by the time I'd got to high school, I'd moved around a fair bit as a kid. Mom and dad were small business owners, had milk bars and so forth. And we'd moved around a bit. 

So a couple of things that I learned from the next session that we did was, I really had no connection to a community because I was always a new kid on the block. And then also the impact that this bullying had had. 

And I really, and you know, this was years and years later, really didn't understand that the full impact of that bullying and how it had affected me. But it was something that I'd swept under the carpet. So there's an underlying theme to my story. And that is that, you know, I didn't do, I didn't take action or do things about how I was feeling at the time. 

One, growing up, being bullied at school, you didn't wanna go and dab on anyone. And you just accepted that it was part of life, but it did have a big impact. So from the start of year seven, I was a straight A student. 

And by the time I got to year nine at that school, which was a Catholic boy school in Melbourne, I was failing school. And then... mom and dad decided to move to the country and become dairy farmers, which I thought was fantastic. So as I said, like I basically swept that part of my life under the carpet and just left it in Melbourne and moved to the country, which was a whole different experience, like moving from the city, or out of suburbs of Melbourne to the country was just fantastic. It was like a freeing experience. 

And I often say in my talk, yeah. I loved farming because we had friends that were dairy farmers in Gippsland. My mom's uncle was a dairy farmer in Northern Victoria. I love farming and farming to me was all about tractors, motorbikes and slug guns. That was what farming was to me. And I thought this is fantastic. 

Life is great. Like I'm moving to a farm, I'm gonna have my own motorbike, my own slug gun. I'm gonna have all this freedom where, even though growing up in the 80s in... in Melbourne where we were, you know, where I was living was a developing suburb. 

So, you know, we were the first house in our residential estate where I lived before we moved to the country. So, you know, we had a lot of freedom back in those days. We used to get up to some great fun, the group of fellows that I used to knock around with. But moving to the country was just a whole different experience and it was great. But, you know, one thing that didn't really improve was the schooling. I think I'd lost that. you know, lost that, um, those skills, those study skills. 

And, you know, because I'd been subjected to this bullying, uh, you know, I just lost interest in school. 

So moving to a new school in a new environment didn't really change things. You know, I still, I had eight, eight weeks in that school year left. When we moved to the country to kind of pull, turn things around and, you know, that didn't happen, I still failed year nine, but went up to year 10 and wasn't too long into that year when mom and dad were called into the office and said, look, let's find something for this kid to do. And that career that I chose was farming. 

And that's how I become a farmer and started working on a farm with a guy who was the best dairy farmer in the district. And he promised to teach me everything I needed to know. And that's what he did over those few years. He taught me everything I needed to know. 

And by the time I got to 22, The age of 22, I was fairly naive and life was good. You know, I was playing senior footy and you know, we'd won premierships and I'd found a girlfriend and you know, everything was really good and had a job, you know, I'd left school and had a job felt, you know, like I was, you know, like every 22 year old, I think I thought I was bulletproof and, um, decided that I knew everything I needed to know. So I went and bought my own farm. or was actually 200 acres next door to mum and dad's farm. 

So we joined that naively as that 22 year old went into business with mum and dad, which any of the listeners that are in family businesses know that can be fraught with danger and went into business with the bank because they lent me the money. 

But I went into business with my silent business partner, which I really didn't pay her enough respect and. and her name's Mother Nature, and she was the one that was going to throw some curveballs at me.

 Looking at that change, that change to move to the bush, I know in your current persona, you work across all sectors, all communities, all ages, but looking at that farming and agriculture space just for a moment, what are some of the unique challenges faced by farmers in those rural and remote areas as far as their wellness and mental health is concerned? 

Yeah, and I think that played out in the next part, like the next bit of my story, like we faced, as I said, Mother Nature was my silent business partner and she threw me some curve balls and the first one of those was a flood. 

And then, as I said, family businesses aren't sometimes smooth sailing and we had a family bus stop on our farm and I ended up buying my parents out and then their Mother Nature come again and send a drought. So those... Those three things are very common in any community. 

Like I always really make sure that everyone understands. Like I don't think my story is unique and it's not. I'm just lucky enough that I get to share it in communities and hopefully make a difference if I can by sharing my story. But particularly in the last five years or six years, 

We've gone through severe droughts, bushfires, pandemic floods, like all these things have had a massive impact on rural communities, particularly the natural disasters, like the bushfires and the floods, they've had massive impacts. And I'm still doing work with bushfire affected communities, three and a half years down the track. 

And you know. those things have massive impacts, but then you add other things like interest rates and cost of living and commodity price changes and industry shutting down. 

Like I did a talk a couple of weekends ago in a community that they've been built over the last hundred odd years on logging and the Victorian government has shut down the logging industry. in Victoria just basically overnight. So they thought they had a six year transition. 

Now they've got a six month transition. And all of a sudden, well, what do we do? And that has a massive impact on people's mental health and wellbeing. Particularly if you were struggling in the first place, you get something like that thrown in. And that's what happened to me. 

When that flood hit that first time that mother nature threw me a curve ball, all that stuff. that I'd been suppressing is not the right word because I knew it was there, but I just didn't have the knowledge around it. So all that stuff growing up as a kid, all of a sudden was in my face. 

And that's how I explain what I now call my mental health journey. It was all triggered by the stress of that event. So stressful events trigger certain things in people. And sometimes, if it's something And there's a lot of emotion attached to that, you know, shame and guilt and all that. 

So as a farmer, even though I wasn't a generational farmer, I felt like I was letting my family and my farm and my animals down and, you know, and that, and that only exacerbates if it's a generational. So if you're the guy who's in charge of the farm or the girl that's in charge of the farm, that's, um, you know, that's fifth generation and you're in the middle of a drought and you can't farm on. 

Uh, Like that's a massive amount of pressure, just that by itself, let alone all the other stuff, the financial and emotional and physical stuff that's going on as well. That pressure is massive. 

And, you know, it's a bit like these guys are talking about in the logging industry, like some of them are, you know, fourth and fifth generation, you know, working in that same industry. And, and now they're the ones that are holding the, I suppose, holding the mantle when the industry shuts down. And. It's a lot of pressure to take on. Yeah, Mother Nature, as you say, is a fairly harsh teacher. 

Business, society, they're all equally as domineering in the life of a farmer. But COVID and the pandemic impacted the mental well-being of not only farmers, but just about everyone. So how did this affect you and your work with others? And how did you address that challenge? 

Well, I had a... had a big effect on our family because we've got two of our kids live in Melbourne. So, yeah, it had a big effect on us. One, our daughter's a nurse. So she was obviously frontline, but our son's a professional musician. So he was basically out of work overnight. 

So, supporting them, but not being able to see them. Obviously technology played a massive part through COVID that we could stay connected with them. But You know, that was massive. But for me working, I can remember it was the 13th of March. I can remember the day it was, um, I'd flown into townsville and I was flying out to Hewingdon to meet a group of farmers out of Hewingdon and then drive back into towns with them to go and see an NRL match and, um, which was a pretty cool gig like to have, like, it's not, it's not work when you're doing that. 

I'd never seen an NRL game. So it was, it was a whole new experience to me. So. Um, but that was fantastic, but I can remember flying out of towns, well out to Hewington and, and then, you know, as I was in that plane, I was thinking about, you know, what the next week involved and that involved being in Tamworth two days later to speak at a, at, um, the business chamber conference there. 

And, um, I landed in Hewington, my phone rang and it was the CEO of the Tamworth business chamber and he said, oh, there's this thing that's COVID. We don't really know what it's about, but it looks like we're gonna just have to postpone our event. And I said, oh, that's fair enough. You know, obviously I was shattered, but that's okay. But within the next 48 hours, everything that I'd had booked in until November was basically gone. 

And I made my way home via Darwin because my son was moving back from Darwin. So I... ended up doing the road trip back from Darwin back to home with him. And, um, you know, sat on the couch for a couple of days at home and thought, you know, this is, and recovered from that 41 hours of car driving, but, um, thought, you know, this is all going to go away.

 And obviously history tells us that it didn't. And, um, so I have to find something else to do. So I really, I'd really worked hard. And this is like business, which I try not to talk too much about business when I'm talking about what I do, because it's like it's a yin and a yang. 

But obviously what I do is what I do and that's my business. But, you know, I really try and steer away from focusing on the business and just about the purpose. Um, and, but it was as my business. So I'd worked really hard to. to build that brand like that Unbreakable Farmer brand. I didn't want to lose it. I'd already lost my farm. I didn't want to lose this and that identity. 

So I really worked hard through that first bit, you know, to stay relevant online and make sure I was putting messages out there that was, you know, keeping some positivity in the community and so forth until, and you know, thinking, you know, a couple of months and I'll be back on the road again, but I didn't. 

So. I ended up falling back on agriculture and, and went and worked on a farm, just driving tractors and doing field work for them. And then if I could get an online gig, I did that. 

And if I couldn't, well then, you know, I just kept driving tractors until things kind of, you know, turned around and now I'm back on the road and, and traveling around sharing my story, which I'm really happy about, um, you know, being face to face and engaging with communities is totally different to being online. 

So, um, Yeah, I'm really enjoying being back face to face and having real conversations with real people. 

Because a large part of what you do is to help and promote mental health awareness and reduce that stigma around those issues. What are the strategies or initiatives that you share with others, particularly in those rural communities who continue to have extremely limited access to mental health services? 

Yeah, I suppose. Well, the first thing is my mission and that is my mission is about creating that awareness and education around mental health and wellbeing, particularly in rural communities because that's where I come from. I come from a small town in Northern Victoria and understand the impacts that mental health, mental illness and suicide has in our community and in the communities I get to work in. 

But I think the second part of my mission is the most important and that's inspiring conversations. Inspiring the conversations, getting people talking. And I think by sharing my own story, hopefully that empowers other people or gives other people the permission to share theirs. 

And that it creates that conversation. And then, and thirdly, it's then empowering people to seek help and seek help in a safe environment. And particularly in rural communities, that might just mean your support network. So one of the strategies that I talk about or one of the... the tools for your toolbox, I suppose, that I talk about in my presentations is understanding who your five people are or who your one person is. 

But I talk about five. So who are your five people that, you know, if the proverbial hits the fan, you can turn to and have these conversations. It's really important to have that grassroots support because as you alluded to in rural communities, access to some of these services is fairly limited Or if it is there, it's a 10 week wait. 

And you know, if I today made the decision that I need to talk to someone, especially if I'm in that state, I wanna talk to someone. You know, I don't wanna wait 10 weeks because one, I could be a statistic in 10 weeks time, or I might just bury it again and not wanna talk about it, which is not good. So... 

You know, so it's really important to surround yourself with some people. And that could be diverse group, whether it's, you know, your friends, your family, your work colleagues, you know, a mentor, you know, just a support person. 

It could be your doctor or your psychologist, or, you know, for me, two of the most important parts of my support network, apart from my family is, um, is my dogs, you know, we can go for a walk every afternoon. If I've had a crappy day, I can tell them what's on my mind. And. and get it off my chest, then they look back at me. They don't judge me. 

They still love me and I feel better. They don't really care. And we keep walking. So that's one of the tools that I try and leave people with. The other tool that I've really come to understand the real value of is what I now call my unbreakable wheel of wellbeing, which is if you can imagine you've got a wheel, and you've got a hub in the middle and then your rim and then all your wellbeing domains make up the spokes of that wheel. And you know, whether that's your, you know, your physical, your, your social, your intellectual, your vocational relationships, finances, whatever, whatever the stuff in your life that affects your wellbeing, make up these spokes of that wheel and, and you sit down and you rate yourself and I do it, you know, once every couple of weeks, um, write yourself one to five on each one of those domains. 

And, you know, if, if If you're a five, your spoke goes from, which is good, goes from the hub right out to the rim. But if you're a one, it's only a little short spoke. And once you do that, you get a visual picture of how balanced your wheel is, I suppose. 

And everyone knows if your wheel's not balanced, it vibrates and eventually falls off. So if you get this visual snapshot of where you're sitting and how balanced your wheel is, you know where you can direct some of your energy. And that become really important to me. or the value of that become important to me. 

I spoke at the Remand Center in Melbourne to a group of prisoners. And one of the prisoners come up to me afterwards. And he said, you know, that unbreakable wheel of wellbeing you were talking about. He said, I've actually, intellectually, I'm probably a five, I'm fairly smart. And I said, that's good. And look, this guy was huge. He had the biggest arms I'd ever seen on a bloke. 

Like obviously, All he'd done while he was inside was pump weights because he was huge. And he said, physically I'm a five as well. But he said, socially, emotionally, I'm not even a one. And he said, actually, when I visualized my, my wheel in my head, I'm actually, it's actually a triangle and I'm stuck. I can't move forward and I can't move back. And he said, I need to put the weights down and, um, you know, focus on my social and emotional wellbeing, um, you know, all those sort of things to try and. pumped that up before I actually get out of here because he goes, I'm really scared of coming back in. 

Um, I don't want to do that. He goes, so even though my physical spoke might shrink a bit, my other ones will extend and my wheel will be a bit more balanced. And, um, that's a, uh, an important exercise that, like, that I try and leave as part of people's toolbox. 

Um, um, when I do my presentations, but there's lots of other things, you know, starting those conversations with people, how to look after someone else and, you know, being empathetic and giving them the unprovided attention and making sure that you're, you know, asking open-ended questions that aren't just going to get a yes or a no answer. So that, you know, inspires those conversations instead of just yes or as 90% of the... the people, particularly the blokes in any of the audience. 

When I asked that question in my presentations, just give you a nod of the head. And that's the end of that conversation because they've nodded, they've acknowledged that they're okay, but they're not. And it's amazing. 

Once people hear someone else's story, how it does give them permission then to come and share theirs or I'll share theirs with their family or whatever, which is really powerful. 

And it really inspires me to keep doing what I do. You've been described as authentic, inspiring, sometimes confronting with your presentations in a world where stress is seen as normal. What are some of the thoughts, behaviors, which you've come across that family, friends, or if you're self aware enough, you need to be mindful of? One of the, one of the, I suppose the real key ones that, and, and people, this is one that, you know, you just. kind of, you don't really pick up on it. Isolations, I believe is one of the biggest killers in our community. 

And, and, you know, if, if you've got a mate or a friend or a family member, or just someone in your community that you're, that you're involved with that you, you notice is always the first at a meeting or always first at footy training or, you know, whatever, and, and all of a sudden they're late, you know, half an hour late or whatever, and then it becomes consistent. 

Well, that should be a bit of a trigger in your head. Who's what's going on here or, or you, you know, someone who's always immaculately kept, you know, they've always got the, for me, it's a bit hard brush your hair, but always got their night, their hair always looks good or they're always in good clothes. 

Next minute they're. Bubbling around in their trackies and they're, you know, they've grown a beard and they don't, you know, for, and they don't want to look smart. It's just a shaggy old beard or whatever, or, you know, one of the, the women that, yeah, that, you know, Um, you know, it was always immaculately dressed the next minute. They're not, or all these little subtle telltale signs of things that you should be keeping, especially if they're close to you, but you know, even if they're not, um, people in your community, even just those subtle things. And all of a sudden, if there's a pattern starting to appear, maybe you need to have the courage to have that conversation with those people. 

Like they're just subtle things, but then, you know, there's obviously, you know, the, the more. Um, outgoing emotions like anger and sadness and all those things that, you know, but for me, it was, you know, I started to isolate myself and, and I had no tools in my toolbox for my anger and frustration as well. 

Like, so, you know, people. I do now, but I didn't then say, you know, you notice it, you know, if people are always sad or they're crying at the, you know, at the, the littlest of things, you know, maybe it's. there's something else going on. And I think that's when, you know, we've kind of lost that as a human, as a human collective that we've lost that real empathy for each other, I think, and don't want to get involved. Like I had a perfect example, a local bloke from our area here, he put a post up the other day on Facebook and he goes, this is a real lesson. If your gut feel tells you there's something wrong, act on it. 

And it was, he was driving past a car and, um, you know, you see cars, two cars pulled up on the side of the road and it was a man and a woman and she looked a little bit distressed, but he thought nothing of it and he drove past it and he thought, no wonder what's going on. 

So he turned around and actually it was, you know, uh, you know, domestic violence, um, situation happening on the side of the road and he's so glad he went back because, you know, but. But he drove past and as normally like it's like walking past someone in distress in the street. No one wants to get involved. No one wants to, you know, and one of the things with mental health is no one wants to ask those questions. Cause we all fear that we've got to have advice and we've got to have answers. But sometimes people just need you to sit there and listen, um, just there and listen and, and let them get them off their chest. 

And, you know, and, and I think that's part of the role that I play, you know, is try and create that awareness and education. So. If you do come across someone like that, you kind of know a little bit of what you need to do or how you know, to reach out to services or how to support that person and get them some help. Yeah. So that's, there's lots of those little things, but just the subtle signs of things that we need to start picking up on, we've kind of lost that skill a little bit, so it's just reiterating those, those sort of skills. 

Now I know you're a very understated sort of guy and the only drum you beat is pretty much for the sake of others. and perhaps the Richmond Tigers footy club. But there's little doubt that as the unbreakable farmer, you've made a positive impact on the mental wellbeing of many people. What are some of the success stories for one of a better term or examples of how the whole unbreakable farmer concept has impacted on the mental wellbeing of others? 

Well, I've got a story and, and I actually, I started to get a bit of a tear in me eye because she actually messaged me the other day and this is like, four and a half years down the track. I call it Lucy's story. And it was a girl that I met at an event that I did. She was a young girl. So it really had an impact on me because I had a young daughter at the same age at the same time kind of thing. 

And it taught me one really, really valuable lesson straight off the bat is that as a parent, um, your kids aren't necessarily going to come and talk to you. That was the first very, um, straight off the bat, you know, lesson. But the other lesson was the first time someone had really come up to me after one of my talks and, you know, and I was a bit not disgruntled with speaking, but I'm thinking, am I on the right path here? You know, like, or do I just go back to farming or whatever? 

And it was the first time I'd really thought that. I'd had an impact on someone and we had a discussion after this event and she shared her story with me and had a massive impact on what I do now. And I said that to her in this reply to this message, you'll never know the impact that you had on where the unbreakable farmer is now. And we shared our story and her mother and I And we were checking him on each other every now and again. 

And, and, and her journey's been up and down and, and now thankfully she's, you know, um, come out the other side and she's all good. But the, the one thing that really changed what I do and the impact was that the ultimate compliment that she paid to me was she actually stood up a couple of years later after we met and stood in front of her school and shared her own story. And that was the ultimate compliment to Andy speaker because she paid my story forward by sharing hers. 

And then the impact that she had by sharing her story was massive at that school because kids went to the school counselor that had never been to the school counselor before because she was brave enough to share her story. And that was the ultimate compliment that she could pay me. And that ended up being, you know, the catalyst for me to continue to do what I do and really know that I was on the right track. And this is my purpose and this is what I need to do. And, um, so I really, from that day on, why I changed my whole perception. 

That was interesting. Cause my perception before that was, um, you know, to be a successful as a speaker, I needed to speak at the palladium room at the crown casino. That was my, you know, in this head, but after that day, it was. Focus on your rural communities and the rest. happen and, you know, I did, and, you know, I don't mind. 

I love doing talks in the middle of a paddock with a group of farmers or, you know, uh, you know, whatever it is in a small country, a community in a small country town in the middle of, you know, Timbuktu, you know, in this little hall that's, you know, 150 years old that, you know, I love doing those sort of gigs, but ironically, after I changed that whole thinking, I ended up doing a speaking gig at the Crown Casino. And it was just because I changed my whole perception of where I wanted to be. 

So that's like Lucy's story is one of my success stories because she's a psychology student now, nearly qualified. And it's just not that was all to do with me, but just the impact she doesn't realize the impact she had on me. And like another one, I had a farmer come up to me afterwards and always say before my speaking gigs, if you're feeling uncomfortable, give me... Oh, yeah. And you want to leave, leave. 

But if you're just going, cause you're sick of listening to me, give me a thumbs up. Um, but if you're actually stressed or you it's triggered something, give me a thumbs down as you walk out and I'll make sure someone comes and supports you. And anyway, after this speaking gig, it was a massive 800 people in the room, plenary speaker at a conference. 

And, and I thought I'd stuff my whole gig. Like I just got my timing wrong. Everything was wrong. And I've walked off of basically went to the back of the room, sulking. Next minute this bloke comes up in front of me is that he, as I found out, he was about in his middle seventies, but he was about six foot five. I'm six foot three. So I'm tall, you know, I'm tall enough, but then this guy's towering above me. And he had the biggest hands that I've, he come and shook me hand and he just about took my whole arm as he, as he did it. 

And he called me every name under the sun. You know, lots of ones that start with F and C and everything like that. And. And I'm thinking, well, I really did stuff big gig. And he goes, no, but how the was I meant to stand up in front of 800 people and give you the thumbs down and walk out of the room because I'm sitting there and I'm crying and I'm thinking, holy shit. I said, but I think, mate, you've missed the whole thing of my talk. Like that's, that's powerful. 

You know, it's a sign of strength to do that. He goes, no, but I'm the best frigging farmer in the district. And they were all thought I was a weak bastard. Anyway, the success story from that was that I said to him, well, I noticed, which I do. I, when I speak, I would call it the Michael Hutchins syndrome, because I'm a massive in excess fan and Michael Hutchins was blind as a bat. So every concert that he, that he played within excess was an intimate concert. 

Cause he could only see the few, the front seven or eight rows, even if there was a hundred thousand people in the stadium. And, um, I do that when I talk, I try. pick out some people in the audience that are actually resonating with my story. So I ended up having individual conversations with them. 

And he was one of them that day and he was sitting with two blokes. And I said, who are they? And he said, they're my best mates. I said, well, do they know what you've just told me? He said, no bloody way. Cause they, once again, I think I'm a weak bastard. And I said, well, go and tell them what you've just told me. And sure enough, about half an hour later, these two guys come up to me and they go, we had no idea. But the ironical part of that, that is one of the other guys had been struggling with his mental health for 20 years as well, but they'd never talked about it. 

And they've been best mates since they were kids. So it was, you know, well, I now know that they do have talks regularly. They catch up with each other a fair bit about and have these discussions. And from them doing that, that's made them leaders in their community, which they already were, but they're now leaders in. in that mental health space because other people are, because they're sharing their stories, they share theirs. So it just has this ripple effect. 

So it's very powerful. It's all about knowing you're not alone. It's all about having those conversations and it's all about being brave enough to actually, whether it's talking to your mates or talking to the dogs when you're actually out on a walk, but at a broader level though, particularly in the agricultural industry, um, what do we need to do to reduce the stigma surrounding mental health? and the issues that go along with it to create a more supportive environment for farmers who might be struggling. 

Well, just in rural communities in general, like they're, you know, one of the best things and the worst things about a rural community is everyone knows everything about everyone. 

That's, it can be a very great, you know, fantastic thing or it can be a bad thing. And it's breaking down that, you know, that small talk. And so I think it just comes back to what I said before about having empathy and understanding about people. And, but, you know, making sure that there is that safe environment where, and look, we've come a long way. Don't get me wrong. 

We've come a long way, but, you know, to talk about these things like they're. There's still suicides in our community that just get brushed under the carpet and never get talked about. There's some really brave families that have had suicides in their family that have said, well, I'm not gonna brush this under the carpet. 

This is what it is. And we're gonna talk about it, which is making big change as well. But to brush it under the carpet and not deal with it as a family, but then on a community level is really, creates more of that stigma because then especially in small communities, because it just gets people talking, you're better off nailing it from the start and saying this is what it is. 

So yeah, being more empathetic to each other and understanding and, and one of the things, you know, obviously rural communities are tied with that stoic brush and everyone's, you know, where resilience he's a word that's just overused, especially in rural communities. Like I was talking to the flood recovery officer at Rochester, which is the next town to us the other day, and I said, you know, people get sick of getting called resilient. Rochester, a very resilient community. Most of the people aren't living in the house at the moment. 

They're not resilient. Resilience to me, or my perception of resilience is like theirs as well as resilience is not so much a character trait, but sometimes it's just born out of lack of any other options. You've just got to keep going. And sometimes that can be a dangerous place. 

And that was part of my story is, you know, getting yourself up and dusting yourself off every, all the time, thinking, well, I've just got to keep going because that's, um, you know, I'm tough and I'm from a rural community. You've just got to keep going. Well, sometimes you've got to stop and think and reassess and maybe do, do an exercise like the unbreakable wheel of wellbeing, just to understand where you're at and where you've got to focus your energy. 

It's, um, It's a very intricate space. And if everyone, I don't think anyone's got the answers. I was lucky enough to speak with Patrick McGorry one day, he's the professor of, in mental health. And Pat said to me, and he's the eminent mental health expert in Australia. 

And he said, I haven't got all the answers. So when he told me that it was kind of a freeing experience because I'm thinking, well, I would never have all the answers if he's, this professor in, you know. majoring in mental health and he's got not all the answers. 

So I think it's just trying to gain more understanding and just picking up and basically just being very, very good humans and gaining some of those really good traits that humans should have like, that empathy and understanding and support and like a sense of community. If there is one piece of advice though, that you could convey to anyone out there who may not be ready to talk yet about their own situation now, but who may be prepared to listen, what would that be? 

Look, hanging there is one of the things, you know, you're not on your own, is a great piece of advice. Cause when you're in that space. in that dark spot in your life. And particularly when you're not ready to talk about it, you know, you feel very isolated, but you aren't on your own and there is support around you. You just have to reach out for it when you're ready. 

Yeah, but the three things that I always share, you know, with people, my three biggest failures, but are my three greatest lessons is you've got to communicate, communication's key. You've got to stay connected to your community, whatever that looks like to you. 

Um, and thirdly, um, you've got to seek help. You've just got to reach out and seek help. And, and, and that is a tough step to take. Um, but that's why you need that support network around you to be able to support you so you can take that step. Um, and whether that's just firstly talking to them and then eventually getting some professional help, but you know, obviously if you are struggling, professional helps the best, the best course of action.

 If people want to know more about Warren Davies, about your workshops or simply to get in touch, how do they do that? 

Yep, through my website, so www. There's a connection form there that you can fill in. And even if you just want to have a chat, like I don't collect any of the information for marketing purposes or anything like that. It's just, if you want to reach out or my Facebook page, Instagram, LinkedIn, any of those places you can reach out. as we did and connect and yeah, and then we can have a chat. 

And I'm always happy just to have a chat, but if you want me to come to your community, have a talk as well, yeah, we can discuss that as well. Warren Davies, the message you deliver is unpretentious. 

It's straightforward, but the challenges you're facing and we're all facing is immense, particularly given the lines are starting to blur on so many aspects of who we are, society's expectations. and our own wellbeing. 

Thank you for the work you're doing and joining me today on Brainstorm. 

No, thank you, Guy. It's been a pleasure speaking with you. 

The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are for informational purposes and not intended as a substitute for professional advice, diagnosis or treatment. 

For questions about your own emotional health and wellbeing, please consult a medical professional.